New Challenge Cup Format

[ginger]

It is getting to the point where travel costs shouldn't be used as an excuse. I'm not saying it's cheap but this is just making the league look daft. Massive advantage for Belfast unless Clan finally get their act together.

The EIHL can't crow on one hand about all the "booming" attendances from the season past, yet at the same time plead poverty over the potential of slightly more expensive travel for a Cup format that would suck much less than this mess that requires a math doctorate to comprehend.

People are fed-up playing "rivals" all the time. If it were for finally having a proper play-off format, that would be something, but alas no change in that competition. For our group, it's 12 games just for the 1st stage, a play-out match if you don't win the group, then the 2 legs of Semi final and a one-off Final. So could be as much as 16 games, then your 54 league games, and up to 4 games of play-offs, so 74 competitive matches potentially on the table, and at least 4 pre-season matches. That's an insane amount of games to be playing at this level of hockey, particularly with the new signing limitations.

They really should have found a way to make the Cup straight up randomly drawn knockout, throw in the top 2 NIHL National sides from last season, and use "play-ins" to make it work. Then save the round-robin format for the 1st round of the play-offs instead, not the most ideal way I'd like it, but it would at least be refreshing.

Just 2 groups of 5 - 10 group games each, top 2 in each play semis and then final.

Proper playoff series are never going to be possible until teams own/operate their rinks/arenas, as the potential for unused dates is too high.

Arena (especially) operators could book concerts for those dates, which would generate large income, so teams would end up having to agree to cover loss of potential earnings. Teams are businesses too, and no business is going to go for an option that on paper loses them money (especially when it could happen due to the team performing well and closing out series early!).

Additional travel costs for a proper 5/5 group split should be possible. Proper playoffs are a pipe dream, no matter how many fans think it's just a mindset change that's needed from clubs/league.

[DiscoRay]

Arena (especially) operators could book concerts for those dates, which would generate large income, so teams would end up having to agree to cover loss of potential earnings. Teams are businesses too, and no business is going to go for an option that on paper loses them money (especially when it could happen due to the team performing well and closing out series early!).

Additional travel costs for a proper 5/5 group split should be possible. Proper playoffs are a pipe dream, no matter how many fans think it's just a mindset change that's needed from clubs/league.

Not wanting to stray too far off topic, so I'll leave my thoughts on this here and no further. It very much begins with a mindset change, and while I concede to not knowing full ins/outs of venue booking, there is the whole stack of evidence in every other pro hockey nation in the world who manages the format just fine, which suggest there are solutions. We are the only pro league who does not use a series format. It should also help that most of these games would tend to be mid-week anyway, and you can always start with best of 3 or 5 series first to see how it goes, and reduce the risk. I would think there is scope for being able to insure for cancelling a booking date, or at least being able to do so for a smaller fee. The league do not help themselves in failing year after year to pick up title sponsors for their 3 competitions, money generated that could help overcome the obstacles mentioned. No matter how much things seem to progress, and how much fans kindly respond by both turning up in ever increasing numbers, and handing more money over, the league always seems to stick with this small-league, and lack of imagination/innovation mentality, it's just always about maximising gates at the cost to everything else. It's severely holding the league back.

[ginger]

I don't think anyone running clubs would object to proper playoff series though. That's the problem of where fans come at this from - they've decided the problem is owners mindset and then take it to it's logical conclusion.

This is where I think fans need to have a bit of trust in ownership/GMs. Looking at Steelers, we are in the best financial position we have ever been in throughout our history. That's because TS has actually built a viable business model. If a cost/benefit analysis of moving to a proper playoff series showed that it gives more positives than negatives of course owners would go for it, but equally won't if we potentially lose a club or two as they can't afford it and can't get costs to work

Title sponsorship of the league is always tricky - again, do people really think the league doesn't try to get one? Why would they not? Look how we slap advertising/sponsorship on everything - and people don't think the league tries to get a title sponsor?

Sorry, I'm ranting a bit, but given the money issues that ice hockey generally has had in the UK for 30 years or so, I just don't see how fans can't grasp that stability and sound business acumen is how we maintain a good standard and start to push forward. Add in cost rises - energy spot prices for large businesses had increased 5 fold last year compared to previous years, and it's understandable why economics will be a big driving factor in any decisions taken

[rnewbolt1]

It is getting to the point where travel costs shouldn't be used as an excuse. I'm not saying it's cheap but this is just making the league look daft. Massive advantage for Belfast unless Clan finally get their act together.

The EIHL can't crow on one hand about all the "booming" attendances from the season past, yet at the same time plead poverty over the potential of slightly more expensive travel for a Cup format that would suck much less than this mess that requires a math doctorate to comprehend.

People are fed-up playing "rivals" all the time. If it were for finally having a proper play-off format, that would be something, but alas no change in that competition. For our group, it's 12 games just for the 1st stage, a play-out match if you don't win the group, then the 2 legs of Semi final and a one-off Final. So could be as much as 16 games, then your 54 league games, and up to 4 games of play-offs, so 74 competitive matches potentially on the table, and at least 4 pre-season matches. That's an insane amount of games to be playing at this level of hockey, particularly with the new signing limitations.

They really should have found a way to make the Cup straight up randomly drawn knockout, throw in the top 2 NIHL National sides from last season, and use "play-ins" to make it work. Then save the round-robin format for the 1st round of the play-offs instead, not the most ideal way I'd like it, but it would at least be refreshing.

Just 2 groups of 5 - 10 group games each, top 2 in each play semis and then final.

Proper playoff series are never going to be possible until teams own/operate their rinks/arenas, as the potential for unused dates is too high.

Arena (especially) operators could book concerts for those dates, which would generate large income, so teams would end up having to agree to cover loss of potential earnings. Teams are businesses too, and no business is going to go for an option that on paper loses them money (especially when it could happen due to the team performing well and closing out series early!).

Additional travel costs for a proper 5/5 group split should be possible. Proper playoffs are a pipe dream, no matter how many fans think it's just a mindset change that's needed from clubs/league.

actually you only have to go back to 2002 to find a "proper" play off series, as some people would have it known so perhaps there was more enlightenment then

[ekt]

So Belfast almost certainly "get a bye" to the finals, a joke.

[ginger]

It is getting to the point where travel costs shouldn't be used as an excuse. I'm not saying it's cheap but this is just making the league look daft. Massive advantage for Belfast unless Clan finally get their act together.

The EIHL can't crow on one hand about all the "booming" attendances from the season past, yet at the same time plead poverty over the potential of slightly more expensive travel for a Cup format that would suck much less than this mess that requires a math doctorate to comprehend.

People are fed-up playing "rivals" all the time. If it were for finally having a proper play-off format, that would be something, but alas no change in that competition. For our group, it's 12 games just for the 1st stage, a play-out match if you don't win the group, then the 2 legs of Semi final and a one-off Final. So could be as much as 16 games, then your 54 league games, and up to 4 games of play-offs, so 74 competitive matches potentially on the table, and at least 4 pre-season matches. That's an insane amount of games to be playing at this level of hockey, particularly with the new signing limitations.

They really should have found a way to make the Cup straight up randomly drawn knockout, throw in the top 2 NIHL National sides from last season, and use "play-ins" to make it work. Then save the round-robin format for the 1st round of the play-offs instead, not the most ideal way I'd like it, but it would at least be refreshing.

Just 2 groups of 5 - 10 group games each, top 2 in each play semis and then final.

Proper playoff series are never going to be possible until teams own/operate their rinks/arenas, as the potential for unused dates is too high.

Arena (especially) operators could book concerts for those dates, which would generate large income, so teams would end up having to agree to cover loss of potential earnings. Teams are businesses too, and no business is going to go for an option that on paper loses them money (especially when it could happen due to the team performing well and closing out series early!).

Additional travel costs for a proper 5/5 group split should be possible. Proper playoffs are a pipe dream, no matter how many fans think it's just a mindset change that's needed from clubs/league.

actually you only have to go back to 2002 to find a "proper" play off series, as some people would have it known so perhaps there was more enlightenment then

In the ISL. Which ended up folding a year later following a season of 5 teams. Not exactly a ringing endorsement for doing it. (I know there were other issues too, but still).

Ice costs/venue rent also likely to be much higher now, especially due to energy costs.

Don't get me wrong, I would love proper playoff series, but to get all clubs in a position to have that flexibility with their rink/Arena and the costs to stack up would require miracles, not just desire from clubs